Not sure what's wrong - even after vet visit

Charlie · September 05, 2005, 03:55:09 PM

Charlie went to the vet on SAT. After a week of not being himself, I sensed something was up. He's not as active and vocal as he usually is and seems to be a bit more protective of things such as toys and food then he usually is.

The vet turned him ever which way possible. I was really concerned something was wrong with his back, but after the vet maneuvered Charlie around, he said his back wasn't the issue. The vet took his temperature and found it to be 103. He gave him a shot of penicillin mixed with something else and took a tube of blood. A lime test was performed in house and it was negative. I'm still waiting the results of the routine tests. The vet sent us home with antibiotics. Since yesterday, there appears to be improvement during some hours, but then things seem to revert back to not so good.

I really thought that something was going to be wrong with his back because he's having trouble walking up the steps of the porch - and frankly doesn't put much pressure on his front right paw. Even walking around the house seems to bother him. On FRI morning I went to take him off the bed and he growled at me like he was going to nip me. I left him alone. He was still on the bed when I came home early SAT morning (after having had 24-hour duty).

Does anyone have any thoughts on this? I'll call the vet tomorrow and get the results of the blood test, but I'm still concerned.

Barb · September 05, 2005, 05:06:23 PM

Did they do an xray of his back? I would almost insist that they do - sometimes a physical exam just won't give you the results. Does Charlie jump on the couch or off the bed? That needs to stop - our doglets backs aren't made for jumping. Also, stairs are not good. Ramps are the answer !!! If he is hurt, the least amount of moving around is key - he should be carried out to potty and then be crated or penned up so he doesn't re-injure himself.

Poor Charlie - and poor you - it is so hard when we know that they are hurting, but can't pin it down. Keep us posted !

Charlie · September 06, 2005, 02:46:04 AM

Barb,

An x-ray wasn't done. Will see what the bloodwork states and go from there.

Charlie · September 11, 2005, 12:50:20 PM

Charlie was much worse on FRI and couldn't walk at all. The most he could do was drag himself with his left front paw as his hind legs buckled underneath him. I had to go out of town this weekend and boarded him at the vet so more tests could be done. I'll find out more tomorrow, but my understanding from the message left by the vet was that the the radiographs showed a calcified disk space. The vet mentioned a long name that I couldn't quite understand over the phone, but it had something to do with a disc disease or something to that effect. The vet was going to give Charlie a sedative on Saturday and do more radiographs of his neck.

My fear is still that he'll need to have surgery.

Any thoughts?

Paula · September 11, 2005, 10:30:23 PM

I have no experience with back problems with doxies but I am sure you will find lots of help from others on this board.
Pls keep us posted.
Rays and prayers going out to you and Charlie

Rich · September 12, 2005, 06:18:00 AM

Intervertebral or degenerative disc disease. You will get lots of help from folks here. Here is a web site with all kinds of information http://www.dodgerslist.com/

Lori R. · September 14, 2005, 09:32:33 AM

I just read your post right now, I know you posted this many days ago!

That same thing happened to my Penny Lane and it was her back, and in fact she needed a surgery.
She had a fever of 104.3 and they couldn't figure out why! By the next week her legs went out.

I would demand a X-ray!!!

I am sure you will be lucky and it will be nothing, however I would not be a friend it I didn't let you in of this info!

Either case..... sending MEGA, MEGA Rays

Lori R. · September 14, 2005, 09:35:31 AM

I can't believe this.... I just wrote you a post on your first message.

As I stated in my reply post, that same thing happened to Penny Lane. She had a fever for a week, and they sent her home, and a week later her legs went and she did need surgery.

However, I know how scary that sounds, but the truth is Penny is fine now, it has been almost a year and she is doing great. I too used to so scared even the word SURGERY I would start crying....
But these days it is very common, and your baby will be just fine.

Charlie · September 14, 2005, 05:02:26 PM

Charlie's x-ray showed me the calcified disc spaces. One space appeared worse then the others. The vet sent him home with prednisone and I have been crating him during my work day. Sometimes when I take him out to go potty I think he's doing much better, then there are times when he goes back to dragging his hind legs. It makes me sad as he has a hard time going potty. He can't squat. He only lays somewhat on his side so he can poop and then he moves about when peeing to keep from peeing on himself.

The vet also gave me the name of a surgeon to call, however I'm thinking I'll hold out for at least another week to see if the prednisone has any effect.

I looked at the website that someone posted as information to disc disease. I saw some pictures of doxies in a brace of some sort with wheels on the back to assist their doxie to move about. I don't think I'd want Charlie to have to do that.

Mike · September 15, 2005, 07:18:30 AM

I would not wait to discuss with the surgeon. I did wait, and risked having Clifford be permanently paralyzed. This was after him being on prednisone 3 times in 4 months. We had to drive 1.5 hrs at 11 pm to get him immediately to the surgeon while he still had deep tissue feeling. The surgeon said Clifford would be fine, but still would have about 10% loss of mobility. This is exactly what happened.

While the surgeon will want to operate (it is his business after all), he/she can give you a information on Charlie's situation, specifically his recovery and potential problems. Clifford does not always have complete bowel control (especially when very excited). Perhaps if I had not delayed that would have been better, but hindsight is 20/20 as the saying goes.

Barb · September 15, 2005, 07:51:29 AM

I wouldn't wait to talk to the surgeon. It may be best to have the surgery and give Charlie time to heal. Also, please don't discount the use of a cart.....I have heard many stories of the doglets that use them and they accept it as we as humans would accept anything to help us get around. Hopefully it won't come to this - but is an option to help our babies get around. Please keep us posted on Charlie's condition. Rays to him !

Rich · September 15, 2005, 11:33:24 AM

I hope that everything works out with Charlie, we have surgical solutions now to problems that 20 years ago had no solutions at all. If things go badly, please don't discount the use of a cart. We tend to project our own emotions on our pets. I know the first time I saw a dachshund in a cart I thought "Oh, the poor little guy!" but after watching him a while I could see that the dog had no such emotion about his condition. He was tearing around in his cart, have a great time. Pets have a wonderful way of teaching us about coping. They seemingly have no ability to think "what if" or "if only" or to feel sorry for themselves. They accept the way things are and make the best of it. Since then I have seen many dachshunds in carts at bow-wows and get togethers and they all do just fine and are just as active, happy and loving as dogs with no wheels.

Liz · September 17, 2005, 05:43:01 AM

I just rejoined wiener writings after a loooong time and I really didn't mean to jump in so quickly but I read this post and just had to reply.

You have choices to make for Charlie and they are easier to make if you learn as much as you can about CIDD. I notice that someone has already posted you a URL which is a great resource and I would urge you to get as much information as soon as possible before making a decision.

If you choose the route of crate resting I cannot begin to tell you how important *24/7* rest is for at least 6 weeks. If he is mini this means a cat carrier which restricts any turning or bending movement (which may allow the discs to heal). No sitting on the sofa at night, or staying in bed for cuddles or going into the yard without being carried to do what he has to and being carried back into the carrier. *Not one step* should be made by Charlie that you can do for him. It sounds terribly distressing I know but if done quickly enough (and strictly enough) it sometimes works.

If he goes off his legs or you notice any further degeneration or worse still the back hunched up into a deep curve surgery will probably be the only route. The vet will do what he has to but afterwards you will have a lot of work ahead - rehab is vital from the outset. You can't afford to let him lay about or the muscles will disappear in the blink of an eye; anyway hydrotherapy is fun for everyone!! (unless like my furkid Charlie doesn't 'do' water :verdict: but I made her do it anyway

)

For some furkids after surgery they walk out of the Vets, for others it takes longer and some never get back up and have to use a cart - if only I could tell you what fun they have running over your feet, backing into your legs, getting stuck under furniture .....

It took Poppy 18 months to walk again.

They never feel sorry for themselves (we do that for them) and when strangers say "Oh the poor dog" I let them know what the Vet bill was - nothing poor about my furkid!! And I wouldn't have missed a day of her; able bodied or not!!

healing thoughts for Charlie

Liz

Charlie · September 19, 2005, 12:12:45 PM

Charlie has a consultation with the surgeon on Thursday 22 SEP at 1500.

So, we'll find out more about what our options are.

Barb · September 19, 2005, 12:30:20 PM

Oh good - I really think that is the smart way to go. Please let us know as soon as you see the dr.

Rays on the way !

Mike · September 19, 2005, 01:22:59 PM

Thanks for the update. I've been wondering how Charlie is doing. We'll keep the rays coming for him.

Charlie · September 22, 2005, 04:52:02 PM

Charlie had his consultation with the surgeon this afternoon. The surgeon recommended surgery and gave him a 50/50 chance of it being effective. Due to the cost, I've decided to forego the surgery for now. The quote from the surgeon was roughly $4,000. I know some of you will voice that I'm doing the wrong thing by not opting for the surgery.

I spoke with the vet who initially saw Charlie and we're increasing his prednisone dose to two tablets a day. I had done that last week and then decreased it back to one after having talked to the vet and concluding that I really hadn't seen any difference in Charlie between the two doses. I did mention, however, that his legs buckled underneath him again around the same time the dosage was decreased so that's why we're increasing it back to two tables a day.

The vet mentioned a person in his clinic who his becoming licensed in Physical Therapy and thought that might be an option to try. I may look into it at least for keeping range of motion in tact.

Ruth in MT · September 22, 2005, 05:28:36 PM

Dear Liz,
I am so sorry. I have no advice .... and I never want to be in a position to be able give advice on this problem. Just prayers for you and Charlie.
Ruth

Merion · September 22, 2005, 05:30:15 PM

One other thing to check on is acupuncture. I know people who have had good results with their dogs.
We will

for Charlie.
Merion & Zack

Liz · September 23, 2005, 06:14:23 AM

So sorry to hear that Charlie isn't improving as well as you had hoped. Someone mentioned your trying ac puncture. In our own experience it worked its magic on Poppy - though she hated it - although we used it after surgery and when all hope of her recovering was (nearly) gone.

We were advised that if we saw no improvement within 4 treatments to give up as it works for some and not for others. Fortunately we saw the first twitches within hours of her first treatment and from there it just got better until after only 3 months she stood for the first time in nearly a year - what excitement that caused - 5 months later she insisted we abandoned the cart forever. Treatment started on a weekly basis then went down to fortnightly then monthly.

Hopefully Charlie will be feeling better on his meds - but he should be reminded that although he feels better he still needs complete rest for quite sometime to come to stop those discs bulging anymore.

healing thoughts to you both

Liz
(indentured servant to Poppy)

Dottiesdoxies · September 23, 2005, 06:30:45 AM

If it is at all possible, I'd get a second opinion on the surgery. If a second surgeron recommends surgery, I'd do it if at all possible. My vet feels that once there is a disc problem, especially if they aren't walking or standing on their own, that surgery done asap after going down is the best route to recovery. The longer you wait the worse the outcome!
Our prayers and best wishes for you and your pupper!

Charlie · September 25, 2005, 05:35:32 AM

I'm considering my options regarding Charlie. The prednison doesn't appear to be having a positive effect and he doesn't have any usage in his hind legs. Sadly, as stated before, surgery isn't an option due to the financial aspects of it. My question would be if anyone would know of anyone willing to take Charlie regarding the health problems he's having? Please don't think me to be an irresponsible doxie owner as I don't see myself as such. I really am trying to decide the best thing for him in considering the quality of life he'd have in his present state. It really makes me sad to see him scooting about when he goes outside to do his business, by pulling himself around with his front legs.

I live about an hour north of NYC. Charlie is four years old, neutered, but has never been around children. He is protective of me and his habitat. He and I have been a team since he was four months old, which is another reason I'm at odds on what to do.

Barb · September 25, 2005, 07:15:34 AM

How hard for you. Is there any chance of paying the surgery out over time ? If you are at odds, please contact your local dachshund rescue. Don't wait though - if he is a candidate for surgery - it needs to be done quickly to give him the best chance of recovery.

Dottiesdoxies · September 26, 2005, 06:39:15 AM

Please, please, do something pretty quickly. Call dachshund rescue, they will take him and get him the surgery! I can help you with some of the cost, email me. The longer you wait for the surgery, usually the longer the wait and the worse the outcome. If you come up with a deposit, they will usually work with you on payments. These dogs are our babies too, when there is a will there is a way! You are in New York, how far is university of Penn from you? It is in the Phila. area. They are usually cheaper as they have students (vet) who help to work on the dogs. Try calling them. I am in Maryland, I will drive up and help you with transport, if you need help getting him there!

dotzmom · September 26, 2005, 01:10:59 PM

My prayers are with you & Charlie.
I know you are in agony over the situation &
I'll be praying you get the answers & help that you need.
I've been there myself so my heart is with you.

Take good advice on here & try everyone before
giving up.