Tummy woes

[Dee Dee and Hallie]

Hallie has had a painful tummy for about 4 hours now she seems a little better but she is pretty miserable, she can't get comfortable and goes from place to place to hide and lays in odd spots. I can't stand to see her hurting/sick. I am not sure what it is but I did give her a different food for dinner (she had it 2 weeks ago). I have my shoes on and have dialed the ER twice now but someone else called both times and aborted my call...so I'm thinking maybe that means I need to wait. I always panic and run her in but there probably isn't much if anything they can do if it's a tummyache. I am going to watch her tonight (it's 8:30) and if she doesn't get better or gets worse I'll take her in but I hate to stress her further with a vet visit if this is a passing thing. So I'm hoping some prayers and rays might get her over the hump! 

[BonniesMom]

Warm tummy rays to Hallie.  Maybe some 7-UP and soda crackers would help.  How about some nice yogurt or acidolpholus (? spelling).  Hope your tummy feels better real soon.

[papbouv]

Sorry but when it comes to tummies i would take here in I'm paranoid always scared of bloat and some thing she ate two weeks ago is a stretch that would be the problem now.Dogs have a short digestive tract so something two weeks ago should be long gone. Yes even Dachshunds can Bloat I rather be safe than sorry and going place to place is one of the signs of bloat,also trying to throw up is a sign, but like I said I'm paranoid but Doberman s & Bouvier's are higher up on the Bloat list.
Sending major Rays & Hugs to Mis Hallie may she feel better now.Papbouv

[Dee Dee and Hallie]

Thanks guys, she is doing  better this morning, not 100% but was able to sleep. She can relax much better but she does still kick her little back feet out and I can tell it still bothers her. I just went out with her and she peed and pooped and both look normal. I am wondering if it isn't a mild case of pancreatitis. Since it's hard to know for sure, I won't feed her this morning but I hate to do that because I have had a hard time getting and keeping weight on her since she was switched to her prescription food for her tummy problems. (this problem presented different than her usual ones though).

Yes, bloat was one of the first things I thought of, having had a Dane who are the worst bloaters, I was always terrified of that and he did bloat one night after getting an XRay (even tho I always fed him raised and several small meals a day, no excercise before or after eating and no water before or after excercise, etc), it was horrible and we almost lost him. I helped a friend through bloat with her dobie and another friend with her bernese mountain dog, who did not survive it. So I'm more familiar with the symptoms than I ever wanted to be, and she didn't have them, her tummy wasn't distended at all and it was soft, there was no vomiting or wretching or diarrhea and she still wanted to eat. Fred was in a lot more distress than even Hallie was last night when he bloated. His tummy looked like a basketball and he was dry heaving and wretching and panicking.

I wasn't thinking what she ate 2 weeks ago may be her problem now, I was thinking more if the sudden change in food caused the problem. She was eating prescription ID 2 weeks ago, then over the course of 2-3 days I switched her to WD (this is all canned), then we finished the WD yesterday morning, so last night for her dinner I gave her all ID again thinking it was only 2 weeks ago she was eating that and I wouldn't need to transfer her to it slowly as I normally would. But maybe it was too much too fast.

This darn little town I live in doesn't have an ER so the nearest is an hour away, I could have called a vet in but it would have taken as long, and at the time she was looking a little better. I have learned I overdo with my dogs and ER sometimes and I didn't want to stress her more if there was nothing they could do for her, since she wasn't vomiting or diarrhea and her temp and color were normal I decided to wait it out. I was hoping this morning she'd be 100% but like I said she is still showing some signs, right now she is staring at me from her bed and not resting like she should so that worries me. Her tummy is still soft and not distended though. I really feel for her more than ever now that I've had tummy problems, no fun!

[Barb]

Poor Hallie and poor Mommy    Sending tons of feel better tummy rayz !

[papbouv]

Rays & Hugs to Miss Hallie's tummy.

[Roberta]

hope you are on the mend  ms H..........
hugs from your hairy friend and oliver and not to forget mum

[Merion]

Sending HHHH's & PPPPP's that Hallie will be feeling better soon!!!!!
Merion & the ZZ's

[Dee Dee and Hallie]

Hallie (and I) thank you for the rays and prayers. I was up with her all night last night, she would sleep a bit then she'd come around and would start kicking her back feet out again and toss and turn it was obvious she couldn't get comfortable. She wasn't in agony just very restless. So we just got back from the vet, he did $600 worth of XRays, blood, urine, stool, etc. When he palpated her tummy he said everything felt fine and she's quite thin so easy to feel. She also didn't show any signs of pain which was good. The XRay showed her small intestine is inflammed, he said she could have a touch of pancreatitis too but if so it is mild. Everything else on the XRay looked good including her spine. So we're waiting for all the lab results now, and HOPEFULLY  everything will be normal and we can chalk it up to acid reflux or some other gastrointestinal upset. He will email me lab results later today and it will be longer for the XRay (he is sending them off to be read by the radiologist).

I am going to start her on prevacid, his senior lab has been on it for 9 months for the same reasons as Hallie and it has helped him. Also need to be very strict about having her eat only WD. He said the homemade cookies I make her are OK too, I make them with steamed rice, boiled chicken breast, green beans and egg whites. He said her teeth look good, I do brush, scrape and floss them but it is hard to get every bit off and I was worried she might have a bad tooth in there.

I suspect she ate something she wasn't supposed to at the fair the day we demoed there, I didn't feed her anything bad but she was vaccuuming the ground every chance she got and may have gotten something I didn't notice. She can be quick!

So I'm feeling much better about things and I'll feel better yet once we get good news on the labs and get her on the prevacid!

She's also on Stilbestrol for her spay incontinence and that has been working like a charm. All I need now are some Depends and Hallie and I can go out for the Senior Menu at Denny's! Gads!

[Tristan]

Hi Anty DeeDee

We're glad everthing is looking good for Hallie - mmm love those longhaired girls ( :heart:Islay and Hallie), we hope all the results come back good. I think your cookies sound delishus!!!!

Luv from Tris n Ivy and mum

[Kathleen]

Winston is my guy with the sensitive tummy.  Every once in awhile I forget and give him something like a can of food as a treat and usually regret it in a big way later 

Even worse, for some reason, when he has an upset tummy, he feels the need to eat poop, like that will help anything.  So what comes up later is a horrid mixture of nastiness.

[papbouv]

Hope she feels better soon excuse me but what is  WD  food??? what is it for ??? sorry hope I'm not being too nosy do not have to answer if you do not wish too.
Is there a reason why Miss Hallie is under weight some times being under weight is just as bad as being over weight,they have nothing to fall back on when they get sick. Hard to get the weight just perfect all i know mine loose weight in summer and gain in winter have to have a little extra padding to stay warm.
I started feeding a little Greek Organic Plain Yogurt to both Buddy and Patches thinking the itchies may be yeast related seems to be helping Buddy's feet have cleared up and patches is not chewing on her chest like she was. Might help Miss Hallie's Tummy???? this has probotics in it for tummies.Good luck hope she can fatten up a little winters coming.

[Dee Dee and Hallie]

Well no word yet from the test results darn it I was hoping Hallie and I could go to bed tonight breathing a sigh of relief. Tris you are such a ladies man it's a wonder you don't have a harem, Hallie is flattered and I am sure Islay is too!

Oooh Winston! I'm glad Hallie doesn't follow suit in that respect. :P What could possibly be fun about eating poop anyway? Heh!

Papbouv WD is Science Diet high fiber formula I hate feeding her that stuff but it really has given her relief (until this episode) with her tummy. (you aren't being nosy at all! You can always ask anything.) :) I used to have to struggle to keep Hallie's weight down where it should be, but after starting her on this WD I have to struggle to keep it on her. It is for tummies but also for weight loss and boy does it work. I never thought I'd have to be worried about her not getting enough. Sometimes I can tell she doesn't feel that well because she will put her head in her bowl then look up sadly at me but she almost always does eat it all. I've been trying to put a pound back on her but like me and my tummy problems, it's hard to eat that much in a day when you feel sick to your stomach. The vet today said he didn't think she was that underweight, not as much as I think she is she just feels so light to me. I am now starting to feed her many many times a day as a big meal is not good for bad stomachs either so I just try to get as much into her as I can with little spoonfuls at a time. She was up 3 oz from last visit so at least it's going the right direction.

It's great to hear the yogurt is helping Buddy with his itchy feet! I have fed greek yogurt to Hallie for a long time but stopped with this tummy episode, the vet said to strictly stick to the WD and the treats I make her, since she is obviously prone to these problems. That is going to be tough because I love to share bits of healthy things I eat with her but I am now giving her bites of her canned food or the treats instead. My cousins came over tonight with their aussie and she really enjoyed them (other than when she lay down in the yard with her back to us and pouted because we were working with the aussie and "ignoring" her  ) She seems to be feeling pretty good today so hopefully we'll get some sleep tonight.

[Teresa]

I'm glad to hear Hallie is feeling better today. It is frustrating not to be able to share things with her, but not as bad as knowing she doesn't feel well.
Papbouv, I'm thrilled the yogurt is working for Buddy. I just had a feeling the itchies might be yeast related, the way they were with Molly-angel. It sounded way too familiar to not be.
Hopefully, all the puppers will be feeling A-OK soon.

[sollysmom]

So happy to hear that Miss Hallie is feeling much better.  Sending rays for continued good news.

Darcel

[papbouv]

Glad Miss Hallie's tummy is better but I sure hate Science Diet products I read the ingredients on the back on the bag too many veterinaries hawk it for them not to get kick backs from it. Wellness brands are suppose to be allot better than any Science Diet product. Hope Miss Hallie sure gets better so she can get off the Science Diet foods if they are making her that skinny if she is having constipation problems you might feed her a better food with the Diatomaceous earth my hubby started taking it only time will tell. Rays to Miss Hallie;s tummy.

[Dee Dee and Hallie]

Thanks for the added rays, just heard from the vet! Whooo!!!

Dee Dee,
    Great news.... Hallie's lab tests are fine... no problems with pancreatitis, liver disease, kidney compromise, electrolyte problems, hypothyroidism, or anemia/platelet problems.
    Fortunately there are no indications of problems associated with stilbesterol for her incontinence.
    Finally, the worm check was negative
    The the apparent GI problems you've observe (pending the radiologist's report later today) are probably from an upper GI upset, possibly reflux.. It will be interesting to see what her response is to the 2.5 mg of famotidine (Pepcid AC) twice daily.
    I will get back to you again after I hear from the radiologist.
    In the meantime let me know if you have any questions.


That made my day. She is feeling better for sure, it just breaks my heart to think she might have been suffering with acid reflux at some level all this time. With all of my stomach problems I have new empathy for that I now know how miserable it really is. I start her on the pepcid in the morning.

Papbouv I agree I don't like Science Diet ingredients either but I'm afraid to change her to anything since it is working for her. Does Wellness have an equivalent to Hills WD do you know? I wasn't able to find anything. I don't know for sure that it's the food making her not keep her weight on like she used to, it could be she was having worse tummy problems than she let on and that was it. For several months now she will have times when she will act like she doesn't want her meal, and looks up at me with a miserable expression. She used to snarf down everything. What is diatomaceous earth?

[Mike]

Diatomaceous Earth Use in agriculture (Wikipedia)

Diatomaceous earth consists of fossilized remains of diatoms, a type of hard-shelled algae.
Natural freshwater diatomaceous earth is used in agriculture for grain storage as an anticaking agent, as well as an insecticide.[11] It is approved by the US Department of Agriculture as a feed supplement.
It is also used as a neutral anthelmintic (dewormer). Some farmers add it to their livestock and poultry feed to improve the health of animals.[12] "Food Grade Diatomaceous Earth" is widely available in agricultural feed supply stores. It is acceptable as organic feed additive for livestock.

From Wolf Creek Ranch website (http://wolfcreekranch1.tripod.com/defaq.html)
INTERNAL PARASITE CONTROL: Food grade diatomaceous earth makes a very effective natural insecticide. The insecticidal quality of diatomaceous earth is due to the razor sharp edges of the diatom remains. When diatomaceous earth comes in contact with the insects, the sharp edges lacerate the bugs waxy exoskeleton and then the powdery diatomaceous earth absorbs the body fluids causing death from dehydration.

Food grade diatomaceous earth has been used for at least two decades as a natural wormer for livestock. Some believe diatomaceous earth scratches and dehydrates parasites. Some scientists believe that diatomaceous earth is a de-ionizer or de-energizer of worms or parasites. Regardless, people report definite control. To be most effective, food grade diatomaceous earth must be fed long enough to catch all newly hatching eggs or cycling of the worms through the lungs and back to the stomach. A minimum of 60 days is suggested by many, 90 days is advised for lungworms.

Food grade diatomaceous earth works in a purely physical/mechanical manner, not "chemical" and thus has no chemical toxicity. Best yet, parasites don’t build up a tolerance/immunity to its chemical reaction, so rotation of wormers is unnecessary.

People often ask why our DE is rated Food Chemical Codex Grade. If it was only labeled as "food" grade, people would think it is only useful as a food supplement and since DE "acts" like a chemical by dehydrating insects, it was labeled "Chemical" grade since it acts like a chemical, but it is NOT a true chemical like a pesticide or insecticide. It is perfectly safe for oral consumption.

[Dee Dee and Hallie]

Thanks Mike! I wonder if that is the stuff they use in yards and houses to treat fleas that is supposed to be safe? Interesting stuff. How does it work to help bad tummies?

[Kathleen]

Thanks Mike! I wonder if that is the stuff they use in yards and houses to treat fleas that is supposed to be safe? Interesting stuff. How does it work to help bad tummies?

It is the same stuff.  I bought a bag at  a feed store when I was having flea problems in Tacoma and spread it all over the yard and sprinkled it into the dogs coats.  It worked, but boy, what a mess.  It's about the texture of cake flour, so my doggies were kicking up the dust everywhere for weeks.  It needs to be reapplied after a hard rain, too. 

I've never heard of it being good for sensitive tummies though, not that I've really researched that.  Winston's sensitive stomach does best on a limited ingredient diet.   I've found that if I feed him a food that is primarily fish based, he has no problems at all.  I've been feeding Acana Pacifica for about a year now and unless I give him something like canned food, he's fine and healthy.  Orijen is from the same company and is even better.  Taste of the Wild has a fish based food as well.   If she doesn't do well on fish, Natural Balance has a duck formula, a bison formula and I think a beef formula. 

[Dee Dee and Hallie]

Thanks Kathleen! I have not had to treat for fleas since I got Hallie 9 years ago, I don't know why as she was covered with them when I brought her home from the animal shelter. But I used to have a company come out with my last crew and treat the house I'll bet it was the same or similar as what you used. I can imagine the mess with low dogs running through the powder LOL!

That's really good to know about the limited ingredient diet. I would rather not feed her science diet forever but I dont want to change anything until she's been OK for a while. I will have to start experimenting after that. I'm guessing you feed the kibble...Hallie gets only canned as she seems to have trouble eating kibble (her teeth look great the vet said but he also said like us, as they get older they can get sensitive teeth which wouldn't show) and I'm having the problem of keeping weight on her now so she can get a lot more of the canned down than kibble. I gave her her first pepcid this morning, we'll give that a chance to see if it will help, then if she's doing fine I'll try some new foods! Thanks!

[Roberta]

Glad to hear all is well, is it HIll's we call it r/d here, all fibre, they get a dessertspoon of human grade mince or something with it. My lot have been on it since time memorium, except for 6 months on joint formula when they put on weigh so they are back on it with suppliments. Emma survived to 17 on it it.
The vet told me panceatisis is mainly vomiting, when Ollie had his gastro the other month.

Roberta

[Kathleen]

The problem with feeding canned exlusively is that there is a very high percentage of water in it. In fact, my vet once told me that if you want a dog to lose weight, switch then to canned only for awhile.  The calorie count is lower.  If her teeth are an issue, you could put warm water in the kibble and soften it-that would get her the calories she needs while not hurting her teeth if they are sensitive.  I'm doing that with the babies right now. 

[cheryl186]

I am so glad to hear that Hallie is feeling better...yippiee....

[Dee Dee and Hallie]

Thanks for the advice guys, Hallie is doing so much better, she has been able to rest peacefully all night and doesn't go from bed to bed all day anymore what a relief for both of us. She is playing again and eating really good, I don't want to give her a large meal so I have been feeding her from a spoon like all day long! I am giving her the script food still and also vet said was ok to give her the homemade treats I make from rice, baked chicken and green beans.

I thought she was feeling a little heavier (yeay!) I weighed her just now and I was wrong, she is down (NOT yeay  ) she's 10lbs 15 oz, she used to run around 12.5 lbs so that's not good. She isn't emaciated at all but doesn't have an ounce of fat on her. I want to get her up to 11 and a half pounds minimum. I am going to start with soaking the kibble like Kathleen suggested, (Kathleen I think it may be sensitive teeth but also her not so good tummy and a bit of being spoiled why she won't eat dry kibble) and see if that helps. I will ask the vet if he has any suggestions on how to get her to bulk up.

[Kathleen]

Good luck Dee Dee.  I struggle to keep weight on Millie, so I sympathize.  If it weren't for the sensitive tummy, I'd give you the recipe for satin balls.  Those are a guaranteed weight gainer and pretty quick, too. 

[Dee Dee and Hallie]

I wish I could give her those they sound like they would do the trick. I imagine they are high fat?

I am so happy with her right now (other than her weight) she is feeling GREAT. Many times I thought she was acting older than she should in the past and now I'm betting it was her tummy, I feel awful. But it's so fun having her so silly and able to rest peacefully again!  She's eating really well too, I am giving her 4 cups of food + treats a day, easy, and she's not losing but good gosh most of that has to be going right thru her, she used to get less than a cup and I'd have to watch her weight. But it sure is working! She really had me laughing yesterday.

[Roberta]

Dee Dee it may not be sensitive teeth, what we found was Amy has a tiny mouth and most kibble , bar puppy she has difficulty with so would give up after a couple so we have always soaked hers.
Good to hear you are both well.
roberta

[Dee Dee and Hallie]

Has she always been that way with wee Amy Roberta? Until about a year ago Hallie had no problems with chewing hard things, she could gnaw on bully sticks and eat hard biscuits, over time it has gotten so she can't (or won't?). I make her these cylindrical ice cubes with blueberries and peas in them which she loves in the summer we sit out in the sun and she chews on one. But this summer she was licking on one and suddenly she put her head down and looked sad and would turn her head away from it if I put it to her mouth so I thought maybe the cold hurt her (yet another way she is like her Mother!!!! )

[Roberta]

Yes, but she can chew bones etc, but kibble no way..................maybe she has me worked out as usual
Roberta

[Dee Dee and Hallie]

LOL it's so hard to tell with these little imps!!!