Patches

[papbouv]

Boy was a dumb mom gave Patches a bone it was the eatable kind with the stuffing in the middle was not paying attention and what did she do she ate the whole thing.Will be lucky if she does not get sick. She is getting over weight can anyone recommend a way to get some weight off of her she is at 9 months old now was spayed a few months ago so just need to figure out a way for her to loose some weight maybe 2 pounds. Thanks for any ideas.
papbouv

[Dee Dee and Hallie]

I hate it when that happens, they get stuff down so fast! Then you worry til you know it's passed...I'm sure she will be just fine though.

A lot of people will replace (not add to, but replace) a fourth of their dog food with canned no salt added green beans. if you don't add food anywhere else it seems to melt the pounds off pretty easily. What are you feeding her and how much?

[papbouv]

I feed Patches Prairie dry dog food plus she gets a few pinches of my homemade dog treats which are made from ground turkey,turkey sausage,hamburger sometimes I put beef liver,sometimes chicken livers,or bacon bits never all at one time I would not think those would be fatting?did have dry food down most of the time since my old Papillon is a picky eater barely eats.Now that we have Buddy the Dobe I pick up the girls food so its only down about 45minutes in the day time once in the morning once at night then out all night but Buddy is in a crate so is Patches .Gizmo is loose in the house to do as she pleases without the 2 pups to bother her.I have told my husband do not feed Patches from the table when we are eating but notices he accidentally drops things once in awhile. Have read about giving them Pumpkin how much do you give of the Pumpkin do you just put it on there food??? I also give Patches carrots one in awhile but would think that would not be fatting.Thanks for the green bean tip. Will take a picture of fatty Oh I mean Patches and try & post it some time today.Going to PT to get some exercises for Heel Spurs want to walk Buddy & Patches the Heel Spurs put a stop to that so if i ever get to walking maybe Patches & I will loose some weight Buddy is fine he does not need to loose any weight.
papbouv Patches Mom

[Mike]

Clifford:  "Did someone say GREEN BEANS?!?!"

[Dee Dee and Hallie]

LOL Clifford you handsome dude, you are a true doxie, the mention of food and you're at the monitor licking your lips!  :thumb:

Papbouv it is so hard to keep most doxies slim. Hallie is always starving (or so she thinks) because I have to monitor her food so close or she would be a little baked potato. From what you've written I would say the biggest change you can make if you can is to not free feed at all. Two carefully measured meals a day with some treats in between, for everyone would be a big help. I have a cousin for instance with two papillons that are 1 and 3 years old. Both are adorable but both are bordering on obese...already! She says she doesn't understand it because neither of them hardly eat anything. I was over there the other day and saw a bowl full of kibble topped with a mound of canned food. There was one little bite taken out of the canned food. Obviously they were both too stuffed full to eat, she just didn't realize how much they did eat out of the bowl during the day while she was at work.

Hallie weighs just under 12 lbs. and is like a little tube (under all that hair lol). I feed her 1/3 cup of kibble, green beans and a little canned food (plus supplements) in the morning and the same at night but with about 1 tablespoon of canned pumpkin added. (yes I just put a dollop on top of her food she loves it). She also gets carrots (those are a great snack) and bits of what I'm eating, yogurt, fruit, other veggies, etc. during the day. The snacks you make shouldn't be too bad if you are only giving little pinches but they could be fairly high in fat when you add the sausage and bacon (I'd be careful of the bacon especially). We also take at least one 30 minute walk/run each day, that will help once you get your heel spurs healed and are able to walk the kids again.

Maybe you could leave the food down for your pap all night to eat and feed everyone a controlled amount just twice a day? Or offer the pap the food during the day at times when you can separate the other dogs so they can't get to the food? It's possible Patches is getting more food than you think with it down for 45 min.

I just hate not being able to let them eat everything they want, I have friends with other breeds and they complain their dogs are so picky and can't get weight on them. I think that would be better than having a hungry baby all the time!

[MindyKay]

Cooked carrots work well as a replacement, also.  Ozzy loves grean beans and carrots, so we were able to get the excess weight off Ozzy fairly quickly.

[doxielady5569128]

AWWW  Clifford!! You are adorable!!!   I'd give you green beans anytime!!! 

I agree with Dee,  Porky has his food measured out daily so we can monitor his eating.  He has never had a weight problem.   If i didn't measure out his food he would eat all day!!    As far as the walking thing, Do you have any neighbors or friends nearby that might be able to help you out?   Wish i lived close, I would love to walk them for you!!   I really hope your heel spurs get cleared up really soon, those can be so painful!!!   

[Delia and girls]

Hey, Clifford! Long time no see!!!! Tell your dad to post more pictures of your handsome self.

[papbouv]

Thanks for all the input,caught my husband giving Patches French Fries to night have asked him not to do that in the past so guess I will be really mean and put Patches in her crate when we eat that way I will know for sure she is not getting anything extra. My husband said to me you feed Gizmo little bites of food told  him Gizmo is under weight a little so it will not hurt her where as Patches is getting overweight and it is bad for her back.
Since Patches is 9 months old 1/3 cup twice a day right plus the green beans and some time Pumpkin does the Pumpkin & green beans give them loose stools???Thanks again for all the help decided I was going to walk the dogs one way or another taking Buddy for a walk in the park in the morning and will take Patches around the block should be enough to start out with.When & if Buddy gets some manners I will take both of them together. The harness I have for Patches is a figure eight type she seems to choke herself when walking with it on. What is a good way to walk her with out her choking herself also if you train a Doxie in obedience what type of collar is good for them choke chain ????
Sorry for all the questions just trying to learn more about what is best for Patches.
papbouv(Patches Mom)

[Dee Dee and Hallie]

Bad hubby LOL maybe he should go in a crate during dinner?  I don't blame him, it is tough not to share your dinner with them, those eyes are pretty persuasive.

You will have to play with the amount to see which will be right for Patches, she may need more or less than 1/3 cup but that is probably a good starting point. I was thinking of you while measuring out Hallie's dinner tonight and I'd say it's maybe even closer to 1/4 cup.

Pumpkin and green beans should not give loose stools, in fact pumpkin is supposed to help regulate the stools either direction (I give it to Hallie to firm hers up and I gave it to my cats to loosen them up, it seemed to work but of course hard to say for sure without taking them off it). Any time you change food though there is a chance that will cause a little loose stool at first but it should not continue.

I like the hold a dox harnesses, they seem more comfortable and they are really hard for them to slip out of. http://www.doxidelight.com/harness.htm

I used a nylon collar for both Hallie and my last doxie Jessie when training for obedience. But I wouldn't use it if Patches pulls at all as it would be bad for her neck and back. I would train her first not to pull, I used a prong collar which looks wicked but when used properly is really kinder to them than a choke chain. It closes around their neck evenly compared to a choke collar which has all the pressure on one spot of their neck at once, the side opposite of where you are pulling from. The prong also keeps them from pulling too hard. I always used the word "easy" everytime they would start to pull and then I'd be sure to loosen up on the leash and say "good girl" as soon as she would stop pulling so she understood what it was I wanted. You have to be very careful with this collar not to pull hard or jerk though, I used it as a training tool only and went from it to the nylon after she learned not to be pulling hard. Have you thought about taking an obedience class? It might be good to have someone right there to coach you.

[papbouv]

Did not know they made pinches that small, use a pinch on Buddy the smaller version not the big heavy ones you see on Pit Bulls even the one I have on Buddy would be too heavy for Patches. Trained a Bouvier to a CD,CGC but it was years ago going to take Buddy to an obedience class at the end of the month I hope figure he needs it more than Patches since he is a horse have been working some with both of them.Really need to work on come with both of them they are great if you have a treat ha,ha of course nothing works with Patches if a squirrel is around I had to go out in the rain & get her one day because the squirrel had been out there.
Thanks for the info just wondering since would like to walk Patches & Buddy together oneday if I ever get rid of the heel spurs.Thankyou for your time,
Papbouv Patches Mom

[Dee Dee and Hallie]

That is so cool you got a CD and a CGC on your Bouv! Hallie has her CD and RN and BH (Schutzhund) and her CGC but now I've had to retire her due to her back episode this summer. My last longhaired doxie Jessie, had 44 OTCH points and was #1 hound group in obedience (but she had to have back surgery at the age of 4 so I retired her...I did not jump Hallie at all because of it).

They do make a micro pinch that fits the doxies really well. Sounds like you already know how to use one, sorry if I sounded preachy! :) Hope you get your heel spurs healed up that has to be very frustrating!

[papbouv]

No,No never would think you are peachy as you put it I ask questions because I have been away from it so long CJ( Centauri Juno Bear CD,CGC was my first Bouvier. Jake was my second Bouvier he lived to be almost 10 years old had to put him to sleep this last April bone cancer the vet said. Jake had Mega Esophagus all his life his front legs would shake really bad when he would sit never found out why.Jake went to obedience classes when he was young you just cannot have a big dog with no obedience so he knew all the comands but just could not show him because of the shaking front legs.
OK more dumb questions what is a RN title never heard of it before how can you do Schutzhund with a Doxie???or am I missreading it that was super to get close to an OTCH do not blame you about not wanting to jump your dogs. When I had CJ dogs were getting hurt way back then the dogs had to jump 1 & 1/2 times their height so many dogs were hurting their shoulders I did not try CJ for a CDX,UD, ect.did not want him hurt.
That is why I was asking questions about a collar for a Doxie I did not know they even made micro pinches will try to find one for Patches it should put a stop to her pulling guess I can put micro Pinch collar in my search engine to find one. No I'm very grateful for your time to answer my questions. Oh did get Buddy into an obedience class start on the 30th do to his breed & size felt like he needed the class more than Patches I can train her at home & take her at a later date.Will will work on come have every since I got her she just does not want to mind when the Squirrel is in the yard.She is too smart for her own good if she has a lead on she minds its when she is off lead she will not come.? I just need her to come in case she gets out the door she has once or twice when people have came over I just tell the people to get in the house Patches follows. We do have a squirrel that hangs out in the front yard not fenced & we live on a very busy street so that is why I worry about Patches any ideas there? she is usually good about waiting when I tell her to wait at the door.
Thanks
Patches Mom

[Dee Dee and Hallie]

It is tough with things like squirrels, short of a shock collar I don't think there is a REAL reliable way to train them to come when in hot pursuit of a critter. (and I loathe shock collars I know several people who train with them...not doxies...bigger dogs but still I am totally against it, for most it is just a lazy way to train something that could be achieved with hard work and patience). Hallie has a great recall, and she listens most of the time but I still only very rarely walk her off leash and when there is a cat sitting on our fence, no way will she listen to me and stop running, at least not the first run at it. I will yell at her because I do not want her running like that after her back episode (stupid people who let their cat run loose!) so she will run to the fence, then she turns and looks at me like OK I stopped wasn't I good? LOL. So I would certainly work on the "come" with distractions (Hallie for instance will sit and wait for me to give her the "come" command and won't even turn her head to look if someone holds chicken next to her face) but keeping in mind a squirrel would probably override the training at some point, so be careful in the front.

So sorry about your Bouv's health problems. I had a wonderful Dane, who was the #3 Dane in the US in obedience but he had every health problem under the sun and only lived to 6. I won't ever get a large breed again. That is wierd with the leg shaking, I have heard of other dogs whose legs shake but usually the rear, and of those few I know of, they didn't get it figured out either.

RN is Rally Novice. Rally is a new class in the last couple of years, really fun, it's obedience but it's timed and you can talk to your dog, you go through numbered stations and you do what each sign tells you to do. Things like down your dog and walk around them, call to front, take 1 step back, 2 steps back, serpentines, finish both ways, etc. Hallie loved it, the next level up includes a jump though so we were just staying in novice. Talking about it makes me miss it!!

Hallie got her BH title in Schutzhund which is heeling, recalls, sit in motion, down in motion, honoring (about 10 min on a down while the next dog is working), heeling through a crowd, etc and also traffic assuredness exercises. So she didn't have to do bite work or the jumps but a heck of a lot of heeling on those short legs. Here is the article in the paper on her when she won.
http://www.deedeemurry.com/temporaries/hallie_article.htm

The jumps for the doxies is just shoulder height but that is too much for my nerves and it also makes the broad jump twice that distance for them.

I thnk some places might call them mini prongs or mini pinches. Do you walk Patches on a harness? That is a lot easier on their backs too I like the hold a dox harness from dachshund deights.

[papbouv]

Thanks again for all the helpful information great Hallie got to do the Schuthund obedience if its OK with you would like to copy that and send it to my Bouvier Breeder we are still friends after all this time she would get a kick out of the article Centauri Bouviers had allot of Schuthund in their breedings.CJ got his CGC with the Poodle Club of Tulsa since their were very few Bouvier's around when I had him he got to be an honorary Poodle for the day.
I'm considering giving Buddy back up to his breeder its not fair of me to keep him since I cannot exercise him like he needs have one last option asking the doctor for a medical scooter but almost sure she will say no.At least Buddy helped teach Patches to be a watch dog I really hate to give him up have grown attached to him.
I did get the catalog that has Hallie's Harness in it but it did not look very safe to me read it has Velcro on it would not think that would stay on very well.Have yet to look for a minni pinch need to to get with the program on that so I can get Patches one the harness I have for her is a figure 8 type I think that is why she chokes,she pulls like she thinks she is a pit bull in a weight pulling contest.
Thanks again for all the info.
Patches Mom papbouv

[Dee Dee and Hallie]

I hope you don't have to give Buddy up, I can imagine you are attached to him! I hope you can get your feet better so you can get around like you'd like, it's such a pain to be limited in what you can do. I am just getting over a sore back and you don't realize the things you take for granted until you can't do them.

Don't worry about the velcro on the hold a dox harnesses, it is really strong. I am very worried about things like that and I don't worry about this velcro, there is no way Hallie could get out of the harness, it is fairly hard to pull it apart with your hands even. Also the front enclosure also has a clip so it is doubly attached. The harnesses fit really comfy too. But I agree it would be best to teach her not to pull first with the pinch. I started Hallie that way and now she doesn't pull except when she stops and wants to roll in something smelly and I try to gently pull her away she will plant her feet and lean far the opposite way until she is about laying down, sniffing all the while LOL.

Of course I wouldn't mind if you copied the article, thanks!